Pakistan gets first AWACS aircraft from Sweden.

from period of 2000-2004 PAF lost 31 aircrafts, latest data is unavailable.

some data abt oue own Aesa

Why don't you create Phalcon thread?
Nalin please delete above 2,3 posts.

smpratik wrote:from period of 2000-2004 PAF lost 31 aircrafts, latest data is unavailable.

any inks to provide us with the verified statistical data??

Killer Bird.. wrote:Hahahaha Man 150 Mig-21s known as Flying coffins in India and and 280 Su-30mki with FBW and Engine problems this is your quantity and quality.



wat make pakistani ppl think they have Quality????....i guess their fake propagenda....n brain wash in madrasa...

No wonder why 101 indian pilots applied for early retirement

bcoz pakistan poiltz has no career option if they leave AF..........poor ppl.................

1*hav you ppl ever destroyed aircrafts of any ...i repeat ANY well-being air force ????

WE HAVE SHOT 10 AIRCRAFTS OF ISRAELI AIR FORCE including Mirages, Mystères and Vautours, without losses on our own side.....!!!!

THIS IS QUALITY


2* yeah we dont hav any choice after retirement in PAKISTAN becz we are much in demand by US n RUSSIAN Aircraft Manufacture n Design Corporation ...however i will not elaborate this much cz i am not allowed to giv these details !!!

IronLady wrote:

Killer Bird.. wrote:Hahahaha Man 150 Mig-21s known as Flying coffins in India and and 280 Su-30mki with FBW and Engine problems this is your quantity and quality.



wat make pakistani ppl think they have Quality????....i guess their fake propagenda....n brain wash in madrasa...

No wonder why 101 indian pilots applied for early retirement

bcoz pakistan poiltz has no career option if they leave AF..........poor ppl.................

1*hav you ppl ever destroyed aircrafts of any ...i repeat ANY well-being air force ????

WE HAVE SHOT 10 AIRCRAFTS OF ISRAELI AIR FORCE including Mirages, Mystères and Vautours, without losses on our own side.....!!!!

THIS IS QUALITY


2* yeah we dont hav any choice after retirement in PAKISTAN becz we are much in demand by US n RUSSIAN Aircraft Manufacture n Design Corporation ...however i will not elaborate this much cz i am not allowed to giv these details !!!

1- So you agree that PAF is not a well off fighting force
Atleast we believe that PAF is a decent fighting force and was superior to the IAF before 1980's and we have shot down more than 10 PAF fighters and have never let PAF achieve air dominance on the other hand IAF achieved air dominance over bangladesh and air superiority over western Pak in 1971 and ofcourse the recent Kargil war.
2- We do not involve ourselves in others problem unlike Pak, we are peace loving country and every war we fought was in defense of out mother land and moral interest hence we don't boost records of shotting down Israeli airplanes. Jewish nation is a close ally of India.
3- Your pilots might be in demand in foreign countries which is not a classified information and so far i haven't came across any article which supports this claim of yours. However this might be true but it shows lack of progress in Pakistan itself. India faced the same problem but things are changing fast in this progressive country.

@Iron Lady
http://www.defence.pk/forums/military-aviation/20910-current-attrition-rate-paf.html

smpratik wrote:

1- So you agree that PAF is not a well off fighting force
Atleast we believe that PAF is a decent fighting force and was superior to the IAF before 1980's and we have shot down more than 10 PAF fighters and have never let PAF achieve air dominance on the other hand IAF achieved air dominance over bangladesh and air superiority over western Pak in 1971 and ofcourse the recent Kargil war.

hahaha..
so you accept that you haven't done any thing worth appreciating in last 60 yrs
this is what you think that PAF is not a well off fighting force i dont need to justify this cz i hav already done that !!!

smpratik wrote: 2- We do not involve ourselves in others problem unlike Pak, we are peace loving country and every war we fought was in defense of out mother land and moral interest hence we don't boost records of shotting down Israeli airplanes. Jewish nation is a close ally of India.

you don't boost records cz you dont hav any ...uptil 1970-2005 India Has lost 730 aircrafts 41% of which was caused due to technical faults

let me simplify your words in three words

smpratik wrote: 2- We do not involve ourselves in others problem unlike Pak, we are peace loving country

2-we are cowards

smpratik wrote: 3- Your pilots might be in demand in foreign countries which is not a classified information and so far i haven't came across any article which supports this claim of yours. However this might be true but it shows lack of progress in Pakistan itself. India faced the same problem but things are changing fast in this progressive country.

well i wont giv any details as i told earlier secondly i said that we are in demand...i didnt say that we go abroad for the sake of jobs !!!

1- Your problem is you only measure your countries success in terms of military achievements. Such achievements only have limited shot term gains. What did Pak achieve in shotting down 10 IAF jets?? To this day arabs are of no match to Israel, It continues to control Palestine, its has overwhelming international support, Pak failed to secure military victory.
2- India has achieved more than any other country including China in its first 60 years of Independence. I said before that I respect the capabilities of PAF so does the IAF and than when you say India dint achieve anything in 60years is saying Pakistani military is no good. I guess you don't trust them.
3- Cowards are not victors, even in face of defeat with China we held ourself and fought till the last man. Were as Pakistanis left half of their country for us.
4- Well if we are cowards than what are you?? You use terrorist to attack us and induce counter-fitted notes to damage our economy and still fail. What can be a worse word than cowards ??? Oh ya Pakistanis
5- Demanded, hahahahha. Cooking up your own stories like peregrine.

we are peace lovers that is why we are tolerating foreign interference(including India) in our country !!

@ smpratik

WE CAN REPLY IN A BEFITTING MANNER !!

smpratik wrote:1- Your problem is you only measure your countries success in terms of military achievements. Such achievements only have limited shot term gains. What did Pak achieve in shotting down 10 IAF jets?? To this day arabs are of no match to Israel, It continues to control Palestine, its has overwhelming international support, Pak failed to secure military victory.
2- India has achieved more than any other country including China in its first 60 years of Independence. I said before that I respect the capabilities of PAF so does the IAF and than when you say India dint achieve anything in 60years is saying Pakistani military is no good. I guess you don't trust them.
3- Cowards are not victors, even in face of defeat with China we held ourself and fought till the last man. Were as Pakistanis left half of their country for us.
4- Well if we are cowards than what are you?? You use terrorist to attack us and induce counter-fitted notes to damage our economy and still fail. What can be a worse word than cowards ??? Oh ya Pakistanis
5- Demanded, hahahahha. Cooking up your own stories like peregrine.

1-WELL you better dont go for curing my problems we know abt ourselves better than you !!
2-you haven't done anything worth appreciating ...if yes then wot???
3-after every war the concerned parties say that fought till the last drop of blood so come up with something new ...
dont pull kargil issue in ....i can provide you with the statistical data (EVEN IF MATERIAL MATTERS MORE FOR YOU TO DECLARE VICTORY)
4-you use RAW !!!!(which isnt even recognized by the HIGH OFFICIALS OF US INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES ) i in order to provoke a worse image of Islam n Pakistan in the entire world .....wearing masks of being Pakistanis ur RAW agents give rise to terrorists attack n ISI have proofs of this !!!
what else you can do MEAN SPIRITED NATION !!
5- IGNORANCE IS BLISS
believe woteve you want ....you are no one to be justified abt this matter !!

1*hav you ppl ever destroyed aircrafts of any ...i repeat ANY well-being air force ????

WE HAVE SHOT 10 AIRCRAFTS OF ISRAELI AIR FORCE including Mirages, Mystères and Vautours, without losses on our own side.....!!!!

THIS IS QUALITY


2* yeah we dont hav any choice after retirement in PAKISTAN becz we are much in demand by US n RUSSIAN Aircraft Manufacture n Design Corporation ...however i will not elaborate this much cz i am not allowed to giv these details !!!


if this is quality then i would say folland gnat shoot 14 PAF saber without loss......then IAF has super quality......

by craeting fake propagenda where pakistan....TOP 10 FAIL COUNTRY LIST

i m suer this is the biggest achivment of Pakistan in 60 year.....

2* yeah we dont hav any choice after retirement in PAKISTAN becz we are much in demand by US n RUSSIAN Aircraft Manufacture n Design Corporation ...however i will not elaborate this much cz i am not allowed to giv these details !!!

r u kiding here???....what do u think we r small children.......u belive in ur story.......

Killer Bird.. wrote:2* yeah we dont hav any choice after retirement in PAKISTAN becz we are much in demand by US n RUSSIAN Aircraft Manufacture n Design Corporation ...however i will not elaborate this much cz i am not allowed to giv these details !!!

r u kiding here???....what do u think we r small children.......u belive in ur story.......

i repeat " YOU PEOPLE ARE NO ONE TO BE JUSTIFIED "

Killer Bird.. wrote:by craeting fake propagenda where pakistan....TOP 10 FAIL COUNTRY LIST

i m suer this is the biggest achivment of Pakistan in 60 year.....

either type in typin lingo or in a right way .....whatever ur point is CLARIFY IF IT IS WORTH IT !!!

either type in typin lingo or in a right way .....whatever ur point is CLARIFY IF IT IS WORTH IT !!!
"samajhdaro ko isara kafi hota he.....kher chodo...."

i mean pakistan's biggest achivement in 60 year....place itself in TOP 10 FAIL COUNTRY LIST.....

so try 2 avoid fake propagends ....n be realistic

IronLady wrote:
3-after every war the concerned parties say that fought till the last drop of blood so come up with something new ...
dont pull kargil issue in ....i can provide you with the statistical data (EVEN IF MATERIAL MATTERS MORE FOR YOU TO DECLARE VICTORY)

There is already a thread on Kargil War. Click here to go there.

Back to Topic (Don't have time for shit)

The specifications provided by SAAB are mum on critical features like ECM and ELINT capability. It is also quite on IFF system. These three capabilities are the most critical capabilities for a AWACS. ECM will not only protect the AWACS but also keep the enemy fighters and missiles at bay. ELINT is also critical as its very important for a AWACS to gather intelligence so that the strike force which it is supporting is well prepared and can use itself more effectively. And if the ERIEYE doesn't have a IFF system then i wont even consider it as a AWACS.

The SAAB ERIEYE might not be as good as IAF's AWACS, but it still gives PAF a lot. PAF will need awacs to check on low flying IAF planes in case of war.

PAF would also need AWACS if it is attacking India deep. While we may say JF17 is 3rd gen and all, but JF17s protecting nuke armed F16s, under the guidance of AWACS can do a lot. AWACS can help guide PAF fighters where to go and where not to. Where the situation is too hot and without an AWACS IAF will have it too easy.

One thing is for granted that once ERIEYE will take to the skies, Su30MKIs with AA11s would be hot on it. Also PAF buying the Il78s, why do they need it? ERIEYE must be part of some Pakistan think tank. May be China and Pak have a treaty which would be that if they attack India, they would do it together and to effectively nuetralise India Pak needs to have this this this..

Or it could be some PAF general going crazy and buying everything that India is. IAF gets awacs we would too.

Thats right, ERIEYE will make IAF's life difficult but still the ERIEYE's SPS suit is no good either, just like JF-17 it has warners and flares as the only system of defense coupled with low detection range thus deep penetration will be impossible. PAF will either have to let the ERIEYE support the strikers by its own and risk losing it or send it with escorts and risk attracting Indian radar waves. In both cases the effectiveness is hampered. I believe PAF purchased this bird to defend Pak airspace from Indian dominance because without force multipliers PAF is a sitting duck.

Meanwhile which PAF birds could be refueled in mid air ?? Do their F-16's have such capability??

AWACS and Refuellers both go with a fighter escorts. AWACS with or without ECM is a easy to detect. It uses its long detection range to keep away from enemy aircraft. And as u said Pratik, with Phalcon range of 400KMs+, its already too far for an air threat. But they would still have fighters defending the Phalcon behind or close to enemy lines. Same goes for ERIEYE.

F16s can be refueled but I think the PAF Il76 doesn't carry the boom to refuel the F16. That is why the F16IN would carry a new system for refueling.

I know that AWACS will always fly with escorts but during deep penetration missions the ERIEYE will face trouble as its maximum instrumental range is only 450kms. Hence it will have to enter Indian airspace to do its job. ECM doesn't have anything to do with detection, it will protect the bird after detection.

If F-16's cant be refueled than why did PAF purchase IL-78's?? IL-78's of IAF can refuel Su-30MKI, Mirage-2000 and Jaguar and after upgradtion the MiG-29 too.

Il78 For JF17.
Perhaps JF17 has less range or Perhaps US was not selling them KC.